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Universal Basic Income in the U.S.?

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  • Universal Basic Income in the U.S.?

    Are you in favor of Universal Basic Income in the U.S.? Why or why not?

    Note: There's 126 government programs (WIC, Unemployment Insurance, etc.) in the U.S. today...

    Why one man {Andy Stern} thinks the US government should pay citizens $1,000 a month

    One former union boss has a bold idea on how to ensure economic stability in the U.S. — give every citizen $1,000 a month.

    While the idea of a Universal Basic Income (UBI) is not necessarily a new one, Andy Stern believes his plan is important now because of "tectonic shifts" in the labor market that will see more and more workers replaced by robots.

    "In order to make sure that everyone has a floor — something they can't fall below, that we end poverty once and for all — let's give everyone a check," the former president of the Service Employees International Union said in a recent interview with CNBC's "Power Lunch."

    Income inequality continues to be one of the urgent topics in the public discourse. There were 46.7 million people living in poverty in 2014, according to the latest data from U.S. Census Bureau. The poverty threshold was $12,331 a year for an individual under 65 and $15,871 for a two-adult household during that time.

    Still, there is wide disagreement about how to alleviate poverty, whether the government should redistribute income to address it — or whether it's really a problem in the first place. Economists at the libertarian think tank Cato Institute recently argued that the income gap was being 'misperceived" by a range of factors that are being misinterpreted by the public.

    Yet Stern, who is a senior fellow at Columbia University and author of "Raising the Floor," argues the debate is being shifted by concerns about the rise of artificial intelligence and the displacement of workers.

    The World Economic Forum projects more than 5 million jobs in 15 leading countries will be lost by 2020, thanks to disruptive labor market changes, including the increased use of robots. Additionally, according to a 2013 Oxford study, 47 percent of U.S. jobs were at risk of being automated in the next two decades.

    "A tsunami of change may be coming and we would be crazy to not look at the warning signs and figure out a plan," said Stern. "I'm not betting my kids life that this time is going to be the same as ever before. I'm not sure that's true."

    However, critics have called UBI a "terrible idea" that would wither the U.S. social fabric by tying Americans to the government.

    The idea was also rejected in Switzerland earlier this month, when voters decided against a basic income plan. It was the first country to hold a referendum on the issue, but others including Finland are examining similar plans.

    Stern, however, is undeterred, and has an answer for those who are concerned about the cost to the government. He would cut some of the government's 126 programs that already pay out cash.

    However, he suggests Social Security should remain intact.

    "I'm not saying we end all of them but certainly a lot of them. That's the basis of how we can fund this kind of program," he said. "We're going to have to change the welfare system going forward."

    — CNBC's Kerima Greene contributed to this report.
    ~ Eagle

  • #2
    Here's how that ends: Everyone gets $1,000 / month and we we still have all of those programs.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by tomhole View Post
      Here's how that ends: Everyone gets $1,000 / month and we we still have all of those programs.
      And God knows there's no way to fire all those civil servants...

      Comment


      • #4
        give every citizen $1,000 a month.
        1. I know with metaphysical certitude that more than a few women will have more children just to get the extra $1K/mo.
        2. What about children who's divorced parents have dual custody? Do they each get $500?
        3. Yet more assets for divorced couple to fight over.
        4. Homeless people?
        5. Immigrants rights groups will demand it for illegal aliens.
        6. What, specifically is he going to cut?
        7. 320M people * $1,000 / month * 12 months / year is... $3.84 trillion dollars. That's more than the whole 2015 Federal budget.


        One former union boss
        Why am I not surprised that a union socialist would come up with such a hare-brained idea?

        Comment


        • #5
          Government support is a major part of the problem to start with! This will just make people think the government owes them even more without working for it.

          People who live on these government supports become dependent on them, and that turns into them thinking it is their money. Just look at how people acted when the food stamps ran out for a few days and didn't get funded. People went out and rioted. They think that it is THEIR money to start with, and they are being robbed. If the government was to do this, people would all the sudden go around saying THEY make 1,000/month.

          Kills the incentive to strive for a better life, and they will think those who have worked to do better owe it to them too. Stupid. We have generations of government babies already. No need to make a nation worth of them.
          Everything happens for a reason. Sometimes that reason is you're stupid and make bad choices.

          Current Occupation: Spending every dollar before I die

          Comment


          • #6
            Sounds like welfare with a different name.

            Why bother working or even trying to do anything if someone is going to just hand you $1000 a month merely because you exist?
            Brian

            Comment


            • #7
              Who's surviving on $1,000/month?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by bjl584 View Post
                Why bother working or even trying to do anything if someone is going to just hand you $1000 a month merely because you exist?
                Originally posted by rennigade View Post
                Who's surviving on $1,000/month?
                Hardly anyone is surviving on their own on $1,000/month.

                But if a husband and wife each get that check, now you have a 24K household income. Add in an adult child living at home and now there is 36K coming in. At that point, running that household is doable on just those government checks in many LCOLAs.

                And if those folks would still qualify for government benefits and/or could do a little side job to bring in some extra money, they'd have to work very little to have a decent life.
                Steve

                * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
                * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
                * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by disneysteve View Post
                  Hardly anyone is surviving on their own on $1,000/month.

                  But if a husband and wife each get that check, now you have a 24K household income. Add in an adult child living at home and now there is 36K coming in. At that point, running that household is doable on just those government checks in many LCOLAs.

                  And if those folks would still qualify for government benefits and/or could do a little side job to bring in some extra money, they'd have to work very little to have a decent life.
                  With A.I. making seriously unexpected strides in capability, there are going to be a metric arse-load of unemployed people in 20 years. Even lots of people with ambition and brains will be unemployed, because there just won't be a need for that many jobs.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Eagle View Post
                    Are you in favor of Universal Basic Income in the U.S.? Why or why not?

                    Note: There's 126 government programs (WIC, Unemployment Insurance, etc.) in the U.S. today...
                    I personally found the article quite ridiculous. No way would the laws be passed to down-size the government. This would mean thousands and even millions of jobs.

                    I also think that individuals would simply choose not to work as others have stated. $1000 isn't free. There's no such thing as free lunch.

                    I was discussing this article on FB and someone thought it was a great idea.
                    ~ Eagle

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by rennigade View Post
                      Who's surviving on $1,000/month?
                      To be fair, this was supposed to be supplemental income... Lol
                      ~ Eagle

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Eagle View Post
                        I personally found the article quite ridiculous. No way would the laws be passed to down-size the government. This would mean thousands and even millions of jobs.

                        I also think that individuals would simply choose not to work as others have stated. $1000 isn't free. There's no such thing as free lunch.

                        I was discussing this article on FB and someone thought it was a great idea.
                        Neither of you did the math either...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Nutria View Post
                          With A.I. making seriously unexpected strides in capability, there are going to be a metric arse-load of unemployed people in 20 years. Even lots of people with ambition and brains will be unemployed, because there just won't be a need for that many jobs.
                          Nutria, very interesting. This is one of the arguments in favor for this kind of proposal. Do you have a link where you have read something to this effect? Curious to get the other side of the story.
                          ~ Eagle

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Nutria View Post
                            With A.I. making seriously unexpected strides in capability, there are going to be a metric arse-load of unemployed people in 20 years. Even lots of people with ambition and brains will be unemployed, because there just won't be a need for that many jobs.
                            I don't believe this.

                            The nature of the job market may change, as it has changed many times over the decades. Do you know many blacksmiths, telegraph operators, or cobblers?

                            I don't believe that automation will ever result in workers not being needed.
                            Steve

                            * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
                            * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
                            * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Nutria View Post
                              1. I know with metaphysical certitude that more than a few women will have more children just to get the extra $1K/mo.
                              2. What about children who's divorced parents have dual custody? Do they each get $500?
                              3. Yet more assets for divorced couple to fight over.
                              4. Homeless people?
                              5. Immigrants rights groups will demand it for illegal aliens.
                              6. What, specifically is he going to cut?
                              7. 320M people * $1,000 / month * 12 months / year is... $3.84 trillion dollars. That's more than the whole 2015 Federal budget.


                              Why am I not surprised that a union socialist would come up with such a hare-brained idea?


                              Originally posted by Nutria View Post
                              Neither of you did the math either...
                              I'm not surprised at all by the math. It's a crazy notion that citizens should just given $1000 a month cash. Lol.
                              ~ Eagle

                              Comment

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