Move and Change Career/Retire

[scfr]

LAL - If you are already doing this I apologize in advance, but have you thought about doing things to bring in a bit of income while staying at home and using any money you earn to make extra principal payments towards your mortgage? There are several bloggers who do that. Creditcardfree and thrift-o-rama come to mind and I'm sure there are others. Extra principal payments would equate to more money to make a cash home purchase when/if the time comes to sell your current place and move to a lower cost area.

[gattaca]

I'm not sure what you and your husband do for work but jobs was a big reason I ended moving from Portland. I loved it there and would go back in a heartbeat but the job market sucks. Also, 30-60 minutes outside of Portland really only brings you about 10 miles out and houses are still in the 300-400K for a decent house in a decent neighborhood. I was living in a lower blue collar neighborhood in a 1200 sq ft 3 bedroom home that currently goes for around $250K. Seattle will be more expensive but more jobs.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Not sure what we would do. Not what he is doing now but I'm pretty sure he'd get something. I'm sure I could find something. The thing is like MM has written I'm looking at lowering our expenses to something similar to Mr Money Mustache. If we don't carry our mortgage our living expenses go down by half probably more. Our mortgage and stuff is like $35k/year before our tax break and that's "cheap" where we live.

What we pay in mortgage is close to what people pay in rent for less now. I have friends renting townhouses for $3k in town over and around $4-5k in our town for a comparable place. Rents are expensive where we live. Highest in nation. Recent article about how renting where we live is overpriced and housing prices has to start to catch up because it skewed due to housing bubble.

But the not driving into the city means I'm interested in possibly looking at other towns in WA and OR that are close to portland but cheaper. We wouldn't be interested in working or commuting to Portland. If we are going to continue working then we should consider staying put.

scfr, I've tried but it's hard to find time to run a blog that makes money. I used to blog and make money but pre-kids. Now my kids nap sequentially. I don't turn on the TV ever during the day. No babysitters, I'm constantly doing stuff with them. I don't work on a computer because I have to keep an eye on both and run after them. I have no family around so days when I'm sick I've no help. Date night is something far and few between. But I chose this by living far from my family so I can't complain. I made my bed and I have to lie in it. When I had my second child we knocked on a neighbors door to leave our first kid at 1 am. DH left after I gave birth 1 hour later and went home to care for our other kid. I stayed solo and DD2 was in NICU being early. Free time is very minimal.

I am on vacation now hence able to get on the site daily. Usually once a week. I'd love to get a part-time job if it paid or I could figure out a work schedule. Maybe when the kids get a little older and more independent. Or are in school. But right now it's really tough.

I'm trying to see if there are other options out there for us. I'm not sure what is the best. My DH and I have been conditioned that we work until we retire. We live frugally save and should have millions in the bank like our parents, who don't but have very generous pensions. So they are able to retire.

[Like2Plan]

Currently where we live 3bd/1.5 ba cape style 1920s needs work (new roof/furnace) SFH two streets down, on busy road, my ex neighbors bought in October for $750k. I think 1200 sq ft with the two rooms upstairs horrible roof line that you can't really use part of the room. I live in a good school district and close burb but not city metro. Hence the pricey townhouse. To get a home I'd really like we're looking at $1M plus and that might still only buy me a 2000 4bd/3ba 1950s home that needs work another friend bought in August. And that's with an hour commute for my DH.

I don't know how I'd swing something $400k. That's a little out of the price range. However I will say like MM has addressed I was thinking along the lines of something with good school district but like say 30-60 minutes out that many people commuting into the city would prefer to not live in because the commute would be long.

So I think we need to reevaluate if it's worth staying where we are or making a huge change.

Is it worth giving up a job he likes? What do people do about private health insurance? MM how do you like buying your own plan? I know CA regulates and is one of the cheapest. If we have a third kid I won't move until we have it because I want the medical care under our group plan.

And yes we do pay a lot in taxes. Our state taxes as well eat up a good chunk so when all said and done.

I question whether you would be able to find what you are looking for in the Seattle housing market for 200k, too. I've been looking off and on for a few years now and I haven't seen anything decent at that price point. But, does it have to be all or nothing? Would you be able to swing a mortgage with your plan--for example, put 200k down and a 200k mortgage? (400 may be on the low side, too--I haven't looked at the market recently).
I figure you will do lots of exploration before you would make a move, so you will be able to a better feel for it when you make an exploratory visit. In the meantime, you could subscribe to a real estate website to look at the current market availability and pricing.

[97guns]

you should be able to generate 8-10% on your money through real estate. 9% of 800K is 72K a year, could you live off that with a free and clear home to live in?

[snafu]

I admit to being gobsmacked when I read your initial post on this thread. Leaving aside the money part for the moment...I'm trying to understand why you want to move back to Seattle or Portland areas. Do I have this right...When you were about to marry, DH lost his job but stayed on because you were there, still in school? I wonder if you have been making a conscious effort to assimilate over these eight years, establishing friends and become involved in your community affairs/events?

I'm probably wrong but what comes across to me is that you want to return to either your or DH's family for their support. Confusing me even more is your desire to have a 3rd child so long as it's in your current location with your current medical plan and without family support. Is it possible that this longing to return to the family fold is a short term reaction from a Christmas let down because there wasn't a storybook version of the extended family holidays? On the other hand, is family pressuring you to return as they need help as they age?

What seems lacking is the research that gives you a realistic picture of the re-sale value of your house. You have not yet checked the cost of housing in a district you'd find acceptable in Seattle and/or Portland. A quick review of LinkedIn would provide a vague overview of professional opportunities for DH.

jiM_Ohio touched on your admission that DH 'loves his job,' while you see it as a 'sticking' point. Perhaps he finds it fulfilling. Does he get to use his education and training in that role? Does he feel good about 'providing' for his family?' How would he feel if he were unemployed? Would it damage his feeling of self worth? Am I correct to believe he'd like to live a bit more lavishly?

Are you considering the balance of such important decisions, money is just one of the factors.

...just some unedited thoughts from an outsider whose career and whose DH's career has caused moves back and forth across the country, seconded to the USA, now working internationally on selected contracts.

[kyoko]

I live in Seattle -

You probably already got an idea from other people's great advice, but Seattle is quite expensive, especially housing.
I would never recommend to move here with $500k retirement savings and $200k for the housing. There are some areas where you can buy a house in around $400k's, but these are either far outside or in Southend, not so great community.

Also, the tuition of UW is going up every year in a rapid rate. Sales tax is 9.5%, and since Washington State has no income tax (which is a great thing!), it seems to try to hit us in everywhere else.

I don't know what your DH is doing for living, but if he is in IT or engineer fields, there are still some markets here. I can't really say other fields, since a lot of people around me are laid off. I wonder if he is ok to find some lucrative jobs in Seattle area instead of retiring, and save up some more for the future.

If you want more info about Seattle, feel free to let me know. I can research and let you know.

[danielhermann]

Whether you shift residence to be close to both your families is a different decision altogether. In my view this should not be mixed up with retirement. I don't think, you have reached that stage in your family/ career life to think of retirement. People work not only for earning money but also for realising their potential. Hence you need to spend these years as productively as you can. Even if you are a housewife, there are quite a number of stay-at-home jobs you can take up. So go on, work some more, save some more, have a good life with your family.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Like2Plan I don't think we plan on working in Portland or Seattle. So commuting would be an non-issue.

97guns I worry about assets and not counting on 8% returns. Could easily live on $72k.

Snafu, I was in graduate school, DH got laid off found another job. We had argued and if I hadn't moved cross country he'd have moved back to CA where we were living. Anyway nope I've wanted to move back since 2005 and he promised when he proposed moving we'd move back. If he were given a job today or was laid off we'd move back in a heart beat period. So a layoff and we'd sell and move. We'd live with our family and find jobs.

Job does do what he went to school for. But we've talked and we both know long term he doesn't want to do what he does. He hopes to transition into management track, and is looking for positions that do that. Potentially I'd like to bring up him doing something he really loves. And I want the third kid with the medical and this time I'd insist my mom come out two months prior for help. It's the private insurance that scares me with the maternity riders as to why I want a third. Unless we determine we'd move then get jobs for sure. Then we can reorganize our decision on kids.

Kyoko I will. I want to know more about the area.

Daniel read Mr MMM blog. It's about early retirement and letting go of the rat race. Truly I'm not sure we're there yet, but we are trying to figure it out. I don't see working as the end all be all.

[MonkeyMama]

scfr, I've tried but it's hard to find time to run a blog that makes money. I used to blog and make money but pre-kids. Now my kids nap sequentially. I don't turn on the TV ever during the day. No babysitters, I'm constantly doing stuff with them. I don't work on a computer because I have to keep an eye on both and run after them. I have no family around so days when I'm sick I've no help. Date night is something far and few between. But I chose this by living far from my family so I can't complain. I made my bed and I have to lie in it. When I had my second child we knocked on a neighbors door to leave our first kid at 1 am. DH left after I gave birth 1 hour later and went home to care for our other kid. I stayed solo and DD2 was in NICU being early. Free time is very minimal.

I am on vacation now hence able to get on the site daily. Usually once a week. I'd love to get a part-time job if it paid or I could figure out a work schedule. Maybe when the kids get a little older and more independent. Or are in school. But right now it's really tough.

I'm trying to see if there are other options out there for us.

I had two thoughts reading this response LAL:

1 - Don't make long term decisions during short term situations. You are in a tough spot (I think baby/toddler years were the most difficult years in my entire life). Your time is very limited right now, but you won't have the same worries when your kids are school-aged.

2 - That said, I don't agree with the others who downplay the worth of moving near family.

When I Was a child my parents moved cross country right after I was born, and never invested a penny in childcare or help. They had no family and it took them a while to build up a network of friends. IT made for a MISERABLE childhood. (I believe this is the single biggest factor why I never wanted to be home full-time with my children).

We are relatively close to our family but could have been closer for when the kids were age 0-5. We put ourselves in a rough position having moved 100 miles away. We had to put our kids in part-time daycare for our sanity. While other people would really poo poo this (what the hell is my spouse doing at home then), all I could think was I wish my own parents had done the same. Our parents were *very* supportive, even jealous, because they understood. I share because you have the money. You can buy yourself a little more time and sanity during very trying times. You need to take care of yourself. & finding some help may be a far less drastic solution than moving across country.

Or, maybe being near your family is just what you need, if they would be supportive and helpful with the kids.

Just all things to think about. Clearly there is no simple answer, and you have to work through what is most beneficial for your own family.

[jIM_Ohio]

You initially asked about a career change and a move. My personal advice is do not link these together. If you want to work, get a job where you are now (build the resume). I see lots of stay a home moms struggle re-entering workforce. I would remove this obstacle as soon as you decide it is right decision.

I would even suggest going negative on budget (meaning day care costs more than the job) just to have the work experience.

Then move a few years later- trying to move and re-enter workforce at same time (within 18 months) is asking for stress. You need to know when you move that one of you can land a job.

[Darly2004]

I can definitely relate to your post. We are pretty close in age to you both and have moved away from family for schooling. Our kids are a little older, at 6 and 3, and we are thinking about a third. We've toyed with the idea of moving back, but currently it does not make sense for us since it's moving from medium COL area to HCOL (different than your situation). I have also started thinking about early retirement. We currently have close to what you have, about $500k in retirement, $250k in nonretirement savings/investments, and $70k in 529 plans. Our expenses is probably at $50k if there is no mortgage, daycare or need for college savings.

Even if we stay where we are at (which is cheaper than Portland or Seattle), I cannot imagine retiring at this point because I would be too worried about running out of money. If our investments were to have returns like the past couple years, I probably would not worry. However, I would be worry about the downturns in the market and how that would affect your early retirement plan. I agree with the earlier post that these are your prime earning years, I would make the most of it now and save as much as you can. We, or at least I, have a 8-10 year plan. Since we have the opportunity to make good income now, we are going to save as much as possible, and then slow down in the next few years. It is much easier than having to reenter the work force if we run out of money later in life.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

MM I am happier living near our families period. Not Christmas not visits, but living closer. I visit as it 2-3x/year. I worry about visiting them as they get older and my kids get older. I want to move because I like the lifestyle better on the West Coast. I want a different type of life.

Jim I will consider that and will likely start to look.

Darly definitely why I am trying to plan 3-5 years out. We could also be forced due to downsizing out of jobs. Who knows? I worry we don't have enough saved.