Sacrificing for kids

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I found on a recent trip home that a lot of family has very interesting thoughts on money. They aren't overspenders, but my aunts made me feel that I should be sacrificing everything for my kids.

More than one said they payed for private school to the detriment of retirement. Why can I not afford private school on our income? It's a smaller percentage than when they did it.

I pointed out that we need to save for retirement. These same family members always talk about having to work until they die. They are 60 and have paid for private school for their kids k-12 and then college private school at not top tier colleges. And no scholarships so $30k/year for each kid for 4 years.

And my cousins aren't making the big bucks. Normal average jobs. I think it's great to afford college and my DH really, really wants to.

But I know my relatives aren't the only ones. I've recently heard this from other parents who say well I have to pay for school for my kids. But then when discussing retirement plans many don't save anything or minimally. They save for the 401k match of 3% or 5%. Not nearly enough and yet are paying $20k+ for private school and talking about affording college.

When did it become the norm to pay for so much? I feel like a weirdo saying that my DH and I are really focusing on retirement and not saving for college really. We feel like we'll try to cash flow college because hopefully we'll have paid off the house or it'll at least be a smaller part of our budget.

Unless I work we can't afford college or private school and neither of us want me to work solely to pay for private school or daycare. Which is another argument that people don't get, you don't pay for daycare if you don't work.

[TBH]

We live in a big city with struggling public schools, and most of the families we know pay for private school. I don't know if they're saving for retirement, but I imagine they can't be saving that much. I do know that most people say they can't afford to pay for private K-12 and then also pay for college.

We're going the public school route for K-12, and we're trying to balance retirement savings with college savings. My plan is to be able to pay for about half of a private college education, or all of a public college. I don't expect to be able to cashflow it because we're unlikely to have enough income for that. We work in low-paying fields with no plans to change careers. So I'm paying for college now, ahead of time, by putting money aside. Kid will have to work summers in high school, take loans, etc, to pay for the rest of college if he wants to go to a private school.

People make crazy stupid financial decisions all the time. We know this. And yet, like you, I am continually surprised by it.

[JoeP]

The lesson here is to keep your finances personal and away from those who are likely to judge. From my own experiences, violating this opens up all kinds of opportunities for judgment in both directions, makes some people become defensive, and also can affect family relationships.

I've since learned to say something like, "We have that situation under control," and just let it be there. And as a spectator to the conversation that will undoubtedly continue, sit back and observe (and certainly not judge).

[MonkeyMama]

This is just one of those things where people's brains go out the window. When it comes to their kids.

It has been like this for decades.

I remember most my friends and my parents' friends being horrified that I had to work, buy my own first car, pay for a chunk of my own college, etc., etc. Which is just dumb. Our parents gave us every advantage they never had. For my spouse or I to complain about our lot would have been absurd. I can only imagine the dumb comments we will get when we approach things the same way with our kids. IT does seem worse these days.

With kids under age 8 I have had more than one parent tell me that they could not say "No" to their kids. Like when we were walking through a store and I told my kids "no" to whatever they wanted to buy. IT's really pretty easy. But, yeah, those parents are screwed.

[bjl584]

These people are doing this to their own detriment for sure. Everything that I've ever read or heard about financial planning says to save for retirement first, then save for college. You can get a loan for college. You can't get a loan for retirement.

Part of this is the whole thing where kids seem to call the shots in our society for some reason. Political correctness? General wussifying of society? People are afraid to discipline their kids today for some reason.

The other part is probably the skyrocketing cost of education.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

LAL, your way is taking care of the present, the near future, and the distant future. Perhaps these relatives have some secret up their sleeves for dealing with the distant future. If so, it would be good of them to share the secret with their niece!

In the most dire of circumstances sacrificing for your children means things like going hungry so that the kids can eat. In more secure circumstances sacrificing for your children means passing up some of the niceties that you personally would like to have (including leisure!) in order to provide basics and even niceties for your children. But feeding, housing and otherwise taking care of yourself in the future is not a nicety; they are fundamental.

[greenskeeper]

[QUOTE=bjl584;361022]Part of this is the whole thing where kids seem to call the shots in our society for some reason. Political correctness? General wussifying of society? People are afraid to discipline their kids today for some reason.
QUOTE]

I agree with your whole statement especially the bolded part. This generation wants everything now and handed to them on a silver platter. They don't realize how hard their parents worked for what they have over a lifetime, nor do they realize how well they have it living in the greatest country in the world.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I don't get how people let their kids pick whatever school and take out thousands of dollars of loans and no idea how to pay it back. Or say I figure I'll pay it for them.

What is the difference between having a mortgage at retirement or still paying student loans for your kids?

[moneybags]

I don't get how people let their kids pick whatever school and take out thousands of dollars of loans and no idea how to pay it back. Or say I figure I'll pay it for them.

What is the difference between having a mortgage at retirement or still paying student loans for your kids?

Do you want/expect your kids to go to college? What is your plan to help them achieve that? To me, giving my kids an education is the most important gifts I can give them. We did not lavish our kids with gifts on holidays or souvenirs on vacation; we saved that money for college.

College is so expensive now, I don't know how parents can expect kids to pay their own way like many of us did. It just isn't feasible.

We let our daughter pick whatever college she wanted. She pays a percentage of her costs, but we pay the majority. We will do the same for our son. It's a priority that we saved for. You can save for college and retirement; it doesn't have to be one or the other.

[disneysteve]

College is so expensive now, I don't know how parents can expect kids to pay their own way like many of us did. It just isn't feasible.

So many people fail to grasp this point.

I went to college from 1982-86. I had numerous friends who were able to work their way through with little to no help from their parents. I also had plenty of friends whose parents were able to pay their way. And this was at a somewhat elite private school. Why? Because back then, it simply wasn't that expensive.

Fast forward 30 years. College costs have risen way faster than inflation or wages. The ability of the average student or average family to afford the average college has faded away. The school that was $7,000/year when I attended is now well over $40,000/year. How could anyone work their way through? Plenty of adults working full time don't earn that much. A college student working part time nights and weekends wouldn't even come close. You need a job just to pay for textbooks costing $150 or $200 each.

Yes there are alternatives like living at home and going to community college and if that's what it takes, by all means, do it, but that isn't what we want for our daughter. We want her to be in the best program she can get into at a school that she likes and feels is a good fit for her. And yes, we're willing to make sacrifices to help her accomplish that, just as my parents sacrificed for my education.

[Barclay]

Do you want/expect your kids to go to college? What is your plan to help them achieve that? To me, giving my kids an education is the most important gifts I can give them. We did not lavish our kids with gifts on holidays or souvenirs on vacation; we saved that money for college.

College is so expensive now, I don't know how parents can expect kids to pay their own way like many of us did. It just isn't feasible.

We let our daughter pick whatever college she wanted. She pays a percentage of her costs, but we pay the majority. We will do the same for our son. It's a priority that we saved for. You can save for college and retirement; it doesn't have to be one or the other.

I second this post. I worked and paid my way through college and then my employer paid for my first master's degree. It's NOT that way anymore. Even with decent scholarships, the price of college is beyond most student's ability to pay without massive loans. There are very few "full rides" anymore. Most scholarships are a few thousand and you are lucky to get 2-3 of those. It's NOT enough.

I save for my daughter's college and she's only 7. I make sacrifices to be able to provide her the same luxury that I had, to graduate with little to no debt. This is not wussifying anyone, it is helping them begin their life without heavy baggage from student loans.

And if the private high schools are getting 75% of the scholarships and public schools are only getting 25%, you can bet I'm going to send my kid to one of the private schools for a few years. It's a math game for me. I will pay a few thousand bucks for school to see her get several thousand in scholarships. I've been watching the awards every year. It's not pretty for public school kids right now.

[feh]

You can save for college and retirement; it doesn't have to be one or the other.

Clearly it depends on your financial situation. It's not possible for all families to do both.

Pensions are becoming less common, so people need to save more for retirement than they did 30 years ago. Couple that with the increase in college costs over the last 20 years, and you have a significant financial burden.

[~bs]

Fast forward 30 years. College costs have risen way faster than inflation or wages. The ability of the average student or average family to afford the average college has faded away. The school that was $7,000/year when I attended is now well over $40,000/year. How could anyone work their way through? Plenty of adults working full time don't earn that much. A college student working part time nights and weekends wouldn't even come close. You need a job just to pay for textbooks costing $150 or $200 each.\

You can thank government intervention in the student loan market for that.

[bjl584]

Another huge problem is that there are so many useless degrees and majors out there. 75% of college degrees cost $100,000 and will earn you the ability to be a shift manager at McDonalds.

People really need to sit down with their kids and steer them in a direction that will give them earning power. It would be a travesty for Mom and Dad to be unable to retire because they blew their entire nest egg on little Susie's education only to have her stock shelves at Walmart once she graduates.

I'm of the opinion that unless you pursue a highly specialized degree, college almost isn't even worth it anymore. You would be better served going into the Trades. There aren't that many people around that can do electrical work, plumbing, welding, automotive work, etc. If you go to a tech school for a trade that is in demand you can make a lot of money and not pay nearly as much for your degree.

I also have several friends that had their student loans paid for by serving in the military after college. Not ideal for everyone, but the option exists.

[disneysteve]

You can thank government intervention in the student loan market for that.

There has also been an "arms race" of sorts among colleges. They build and build and expand and upgrade to outdo the competition. The result is much higher operating costs. When I was in school, we had a very basic gym. During my 4 years, they built a beautiful state of the art fitness center. Soon after I graduated, they added a "natatorium" - fancy word for a swimming pool. Since then, they've totally renovated the fitness center. We already had a nationally recognized theater program which accomplished that despite very modest facilities. So of course they spent millions to expand and upgrade the theater, set shop, dressing rooms, lobby, etc. Dorms have gone from pretty barebones arrangements to something rivaling luxury hotels.

So much of the rising costs really have nothing to do with educational costs.