dad's budget: need to move him near me

[Snydley]

Hi All- My dad is 81 and lives in a mobile home in a nice community in Florida. He really should not be living on his own anymore and some great new 55+ apartments were just built right by my house in MA. He has a pension + SS = $6094. The rent for this new apartment is $2150, and only additional expense will be heating/cooling est. to be less than $100/month. He's bad with money, has no savings. I asked for his monthly budget and here's what he sent me. I'm certain he does not come out ahead at all every month, so all the rest is going to eating out I guess. DH and I plan to take over his place in Florida (it needs major repairs, but we love the spot so we are willing to pay the lot rent for now and then figure out what to do with the mobile home- either fix or replace). My dad will be able to go back and stay there whenever he wants.
I'd love to hear your thoughts on his expenses. I feel like he should stop paying on the loans and cc at his age but I don't think he will agree to giving up his credit. TIA

[kork13]

As far as expenses go ...
- TV & phone bill seem high for a solo retiree. Unless "phone" is also home Internet? Any chance of combining those expenses?
- What kind of high-end haircut is this 81y/o getting??
- Not sure what "money to son" represents, but I assume there's a family situation involved.

Otherwise, the budget presented at least seems to be pretty reasonable... But as you allude to, is it accurate?

As to the debts ... With just 3 mo left on the car loan, may as well just pay it off. For the CCs/loans, how much debt (balance) are we taking about here? Defaulting on the debts is certainly an option, but your dad's situation does not make him "judgement proof" since the pension could likely be garnished (SS cannot). However, aggressive negotiation with the debt holders could likely be successful. No disrespect or ill will to your father, but he could croak anytime & the CC companies would get nothing. So you should be able to leverage his age health/reliability to get balances/interest rates reduced, or negotiate settled payments (though that might require going non-current for 6-12 months).

[disneysteve]

Going down the list:

Electric should be a lot less in an apt in MA than a motor home in FL.
You can probably do better on TV and definitely on phone.
How much will car insurance be in MA?
What's the deal with him supporting his son? Disability? What plan is in place for the son's needs after dad is gone? Can that happen while dad is still alive and free up that money for dad to use on himself?
The car loan is gone in 3 months which is great.
What's the situation with the credit cards and loans? How much does he owe and why?
Food is high but if he mainly eats out, that would explain it. Perhaps you could look into some local meals on wheels types of service to help reduce that a bit.
Why so much for hair cuts? I think Hair Cuttery is about $18 or $20. He's spending more than 3 times that much every month.
Does an 81 year old guy really need to be buying a bunch of clothing? I'm 60 and hardly ever buy any. I've got pretty much everything I need except for the occasional replacement, new socks, etc.

He's grossing $73,000 which is a decent amount for a single senior. He should be able to make things work okay on that income, especially if he can get the son off the payroll.

Don't forget he will need renter's insurance so find out what that will run.

[ua_guy]

Feels like the lot/mobile should be sold to subsidize and pay for his future needs and pay off the debts he signed up for. Or, if you're assuming ownership of the lot, are you planning to kick in some money for him?

[Snydley]

Thanks for all these helpful replies.

- TV & phone bill seem high for a solo retiree. Unless "phone" is also home Internet? Any chance of combining those expenses?

He has no home internet. He uses his phone for everything (no computer). Hopefully I can get him lower rates once he moves.

- What kind of high-end haircut is this 81y/o getting??

He gets his hair colored. I am not kidding. He is ridiculous.

Not sure what "money to son" represents, but I assume there's a family situation involved.

My brother has schizoaffective disorder and is not medicated. He is on the West coast and does not have stable housing and is refusing help, so my dad adds $ to his bank account every week. My mom (parents divorced) will take over these payments when my dad dies, and she has already set up funds to be sure my brother receives this money monthly even after she passes.

With just 3 mo left on the car loan, may as well just pay it off. For the CCs/loans, how much debt (balance) are we taking about here? Defaulting on the debts is certainly an option, but your dad's situation does not make him "judgement proof" since the pension could likely be garnished (SS cannot). However, aggressive negotiation with the debt holders could likely be successful. No disrespect or ill will to your father, but he could croak anytime & the CC companies would get nothing. So you should be able to leverage his age health/reliability to get balances/interest rates reduced, or negotiate settled payments (though that might require going non-current for 6-12 months).

Can't pay off the car loan, he just told me he only has $300 in savings. Thanks for the info about the cc options. I will find out balances and rates.

Food is high but if he mainly eats out, that would explain it. Perhaps you could look into some local meals on wheels types of service to help reduce that a bit.
Why so much for hair cuts? I think Hair Cuttery is about $18 or $20. He's spending more than 3 times that much every month.
Does an 81 year old guy really need to be buying a bunch of clothing? I'm 60 and hardly ever buy any. I've got pretty much everything I need except for the occasional replacement, new socks, etc.

He's grossing $73,000 which is a decent amount for a single senior. He should be able to make things work okay on that income, especially if he can get the son off the payroll.

Don't forget he will need renter's insurance so find out what that will run.

He doesn't eat much really, he drinks mostly. He sits at bars for at least a few hours a day. He really doesn't buy clothes either, I think he's making that # up.

His place in Florida has been totally neglected for a long time, nothing in it worth anything (picture plaster from the ceiling falling down, and a cockroach in the bathroom with me this year when I was there...). He doesn't even have any type of insurance on it, so the last few hurricanes that have come through would wipe out his only place to live with no $ coming. When he moves I'll be giving him some of my old furniture, so he won't need renters insurance.


I'd sell the mobile home, or give him some value for it, if it was worth anything. There are a lot for sale currently in his development and they are in far better states than his. As it stands now, I'll have to pay first month and deposit for him on the apartment since he has nothing in the bank.

He has a Tier 1 New York State pension- which means he gets his highest salary and free health insurance for the rest of his life, and he never had to contribute to either. Both of my parents have this, thankfully!

[disneysteve]

He doesn't eat much really, he drinks mostly. He sits at bars for at least a few hours a day.

How does he get to and from the bars? Is he driving? If so, that's pretty terrifying.

[disneysteve]

His place in Florida has been totally neglected for a long time, nothing in it worth anything (picture plaster from the ceiling falling down, and a cockroach in the bathroom with me this year when I was there...). He doesn't even have any type of insurance on it, so the last few hurricanes that have come through would wipe out his only place to live with no $ coming. When he moves I'll be giving him some of my old furniture, so he won't need renters insurance.

I think everyone needs renters insurance. What will he do if the place burns down or gets wiped out in a storm and he loses everything including his clothes and furniture and any other belongings? What will he do then? He can't afford to start over without any insurance money.

[myrdale]

Feels like the lot/mobile should be sold to subsidize and pay for his future needs and pay off the debts he signed up for. Or, if you're assuming ownership of the lot, are you planning to kick in some money for him?

I agree.


If you said you owned the lot, that would be one thing, but you're paying lot rent then no. Sale the trailer. Do you really want an 80+ making trips from MA to FL?

EDIT: I got all the below typed out, THEN saw your reply with some of the answers to my questions. I'll rereply when I get a few spare minutes later today or tomorrow. For now I am leaving it up. My main concern is around supporting the son in CA. That is too far away. You don't know if he is on drugs and no stable housing it is a big concern as a whole for me.


The hair cuts are insane. It's small change next to everything else, but I spend $25 every two months (that is including $5 extra for tip).

$640 to son is sort of the elephant in the room. Is this loan repayment or support? If he is 80, then I am assuming the son isn't in his 20's. Assuming the son is in his 40's or 50's this needs to be cut out.

My phone is $50 a month with limited data. There are prepaid services at $20 with unlimited everything. Or is this land line with internet?

TV is a luxury.

The car loan can be dropped from the sheet, but assuming it took him 5 years to pay off, you may want to add maintenance, $85 to the list (I'm figuring $1,000 per year).

Entertainment $80 a month is good if he can afford. I assume this is lottery or ding dings?

Food and drink at $750 is high if he is broke. Until the debt is paid, this needs to be groceries only.

$600 for loans is pretty open ended. How big of a hole? $30k? more than that?

[disneysteve]

"The hair cuts are insane. It's small change next to everything else, but I spend $25 every two months (that is including $5 extra for tip)."

I pay $0. I use a Wahl trimmer that I bought maybe 10 years ago for $29. I cut my hair every 2-3 weeks and pretty regularly get compliments on it asking where I go. Especially during COVID, so many people noticed my hair because they were all a mess because their salons were closed. Didn't bother me. I kept cutting my own just as I have for probably 15 years now.

[myrdale]

"The hair cuts are insane. It's small change next to everything else, but I spend $25 every two months (that is including $5 extra for tip)."

I pay $0. I use a Wahl trimmer that I bought maybe 10 years ago for $29. I cut my hair every 2-3 weeks and pretty regularly get compliments on it asking where I go. Especially during COVID, so many people noticed my hair because they were all a mess because their salons were closed. Didn't bother me. I kept cutting my own just as I have for probably 15 years now.

I see now where he says he is getting his hair dyed, presumably that is the cost.

With my mother, I can quote her exact words: "I will welcome gray with open arms!" About 5 years later she had a gray streak come in and she started getting her hair dyed on a monthly basis. That went on for a few years then she stopped.

Some men get weird with their hair. If it were me I would save that money. I can appreciate having a professional cut his hair, but dying is it again a luxury which is fine IF he can afford it. Being broke I'd cut it out today.

[myrdale]

My brother has schizoaffective disorder and is not medicated. He is on the West coast and does not have stable housing and is refusing help, so my dad adds $ to his bank account every week. My mom (parents divorced) will take over these payments when my dad dies, and she has already set up funds to be sure my brother receives this money monthly even after she passes.

This is a really hard situation, but your brother is blessed his parents have been able to assist him as long as they have. I'd feel far better about the situation if he lived in the same town (much less the same state) rather than the opposite side of the country.

Would moving the brother into the trailer in Florida be an option? He would have a stable home. Father can continue covering lot rent, then cut the $650 out of the budget.

Could brother move into trailer with father in Florida. I understand it may be the blind leading the blind, but then the brother can assist somewhat in watching dad, and dad can provide for the brother?

As long as brother is unmedicated those may be bad ideas.

I've seen one guy who was Schizophrenic. He started talking about the TV talks to him and gives him orders. He had just be fired for beating up a coworker who he claimed was smoking outside his bedroom window at night. There was other stuff. Unmedicated, his life was a mess.

Another guy who does scale calibration for us came out and told me about his condition. How he had spent an hour at one client's location talking to someone in the lobby who wasn't there. That even though the medication is rough so long as he stays on it, his life is "normal".

A woman who worked checkout years ago at Sears tried to get me fired, claiming I was coming to her house in the evening and hiding on her back porch. I think she was on and off the medication.

A similar situation to yours, back in the 1970's my great uncle Charlie "worked on a horse farm in California". My great grandmother sent him checks once a month. He disappeared and was in a morgue for 6 weeks before he was positively ID'ed. It's unclear if he was sick, but he did have drug issues.

My point in all of that is that Schizophrenia (and drugs) is so hard on people and I am worried more about your brother being out there than the situation with your father. I know you don't have control on him, but he is a big part of your parents financial spending. If there is anything to make those dollars more effective and help him balance his life out it is so worth the effort.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Well at least you know where your brother is. I know it happened in my family my cousin ended up homeless and wandering and we were fortunate to find him. And another relative is still homeless and I hope alive in their 60s. It's not a cut and dry situation.

I will agree that maybe he could move to the trailer in florida? That would save money.

Stop paying the CC and see if they settle. He doesn't need credit at his age anyway.