The cost of Afghanistan

[james.hendrickson]

What behooves me is why the Afghan military who had something in the area of 3x's the amount of forces vs the Taliban allowed the Taliban to take over. The Afghans it seemed could have kept their power and held onto to their own control but the media says they just gave up.

Because QMM, they had nothing to fight for.

First, Afghans don't think of themselves as a nation in the same way we do. There is far more diversity in how they construct their identities - with many feeling more like a member of their tribe or their ethnicity than an "afghan".

Second, their government was totally, completely and thoroughly corrupt. You had to pay a bribe to get police protection, file a court case, get services like water, - hell, even driving to the airport required paying a fixer. It was said to be so corrupt that 95 out of every 100 dollars spent on aid was siphoned off or otherwise misappropriated.

There was also a lot of military corruption - reports would get falsified and military supplies sold on the black market - that happened a fair amount. For example, a unit would report they had gone on an operation and done weapons training when, in reality, the ammo and gas had been sold on the black market. It was also the case that officers would demand a cut of their men's pay. In fact the Afghan National Army had to go over to a direct deposit system because officers stealing from their men was such a problem.

Third, the Afghan government failed to provide safety and security. Kidnappings were not uncommon when I was there, especially if the victim was high net worth. In other cases, if a richer or more powerful person wanted your house or your property, he'd simply find a way to take it - the law be dammed.

But it was worse than just corruption and failure to do its job, in many cases the Afghan government itself was predatory. I heard a couple of stories - a group of mixed sex teens (mixed sex social events are a big no-no in Afghanistan), were out at a party and were caught by the police. The courts intended to prosecute, but the prosecution was selective and took a while - the reason was the prosecutor needed time to negotiate the amount of the bribe required to dismiss the charges. Another one of our interpreters was caught by the police with his girlfriend in his car - he had to give the police a months wages not to arrest him.

Seriously QMM - some insane stuff happens in Afghanistan that Americans just do not understand - you literally had to grow new brain cells to accept the reality of how off the hook it was.

if you're some marginally literate Afghan guy who makes maybe $200 per month, would you fight for that system?

Probably not.

[QuarterMillionMan]

James that is some major corruption. Thanks for putting things into perspective. I believe you how corrupt the Afghan government can be. The closest corruption I experienced was in Tijuana while walking on the sidewalk a marked policia van stops and 2 uniformed male officers ordered me to put my hands on the van. While one cop questions me where I'm going, where I came from, if I had drugs, etc. The other cop searches my pockets and takes out my cell phone in one pocket and wallet from my other pocket. After they were done questioning me the cop returns my cell phone and wallet and lets me leave. When I return to my hotel room I check my wallet where I originally had $400, now only have $200. Those corrupt cops broke my trust, now I fear cops there and avoid them whenever possible.

[kork13]

It's done.

We can hope & pray for relative peace and stability.... But that's all up in the air. At least so are the last of our servicemen, so I'm grateful for that.

[james.hendrickson]

The end of Americas longest war.

Lets hope some good comes from it.

[JoeP]

Was there financial benefit to those who had investments in industries that directly or indirectly supported the effort? Probably.

Did we leave the country in better or worse shape? Probably better for some, but with all the hardware left behind and the quick takeover, I fear things will trend worse.

A lot of Americans lost their lives or came back broken, and for what? I can see being proud of these sacrifices if the end result was positive (e.g., we won, mission accomplished), but what I'm seeing now feels like it was all for nothing.

Let's use hindsight to take a more critical look at fighting wars directly or indirectly in foreign countries. This is what some would call a "teachable moment" and we need to hold our elected officials accountable.

[rennigade]

The end of Americas longest war.

Lets hope some good comes from it.

Are you sure thats the longest war? I believe the "war on drugs" has been going on since the early 70's. How many lives were lost to that war that still continues today?

America has spend approx $1 trillion on that war so far.

[kork13]

Did we leave the country in better or worse shape? Probably better for some, but with all the hardware left behind and the quick takeover, I fear things will trend worse.

I would argue that it is in better shape, because today's Afghanis, today's Taliban, today's geopolitical climate are all very different than 20 years ago. We've had a driving influence in the country for the last 20 years, with a full generation (not to mention the adult population) learning about what life could be for themselves, their children, their families. By necessity, the Taliban has and likely will be forced to continue to adopt more liberal, inclusive, and cooperative policies. It won't be overnight change (which we ARE seeing as they resume power), but incrementally, Afghanistan's dramatically more informed population will strongly influence the future of the country.

A lot of Americans lost their lives or came back broken, and for what? I can see being proud of these sacrifices if the end result was positive (e.g., we won, mission accomplished), but what I'm seeing now feels like it was all for nothing.

This is an unhelpful viewpoint, and quite simply mistaken. We did succeed in the original intent of the war in Afghanistan -- we devastated Al Qaeda's ability to operate, made Afghanistan intolerant to its use as a home for terrorism training & operations, and punished the Taliban for tolerating/supporting such terrorism. We taught Afghanis how to defend themselves, recognizing that we cannot compel them to have the will or courage to do so. We provided security & protection to the Afghani people and the diplomats, aid workers, and others who were there to help build up the nation. Not to mention the improvements to the daily lives of the Afghanis over the last 20 years that I outlined above, as well as using the coalition operations in Afghanistan to radically alter & improve the interactions and partnerships we have with a host of countries worldwide.

The problem is that our military and intelligence community are not (have never been) designed, trained, equipped, or capable of successfully (let alone effectively) conducting nation-building operations. That is the realm of diplomats, aid agencies, and the international community. While those elements existed, they did not receive sufficient support, so those efforts were not sufficiently successful. The military is here to "break things & blow stuff up." We are the stick, diplomats & those they work with are the carrot. We had too much stick, not enough carrot.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Can you actually put a price tag on the war? Isn't it something that will take years of looking back to see the true costs of the military? If it actually helped? Reflection will be later right?

[QuarterMillionMan]

Do a simple search and you will find a video of an Afghan interpreter hanging from a flying blackhawk helicopter. I shutter to think what else will happen in the coming weeks & months.