Sometimes, getting rich can be skipped.

[Nutria]

My grandma had my mom at 14.

1. That doesn't mean she was considered "adult",
2. it doesn't mean it was as safe as a 20 year old bearing children,
3. I bet her parents were most displeased.

[TexasHusker]

1. That doesn't mean she was considered "adult",
2. it doesn't mean it was as safe as a 20 year old bearing children,
3. I bet her parents were most displeased.

She grew up in Appalachia - I think it was pretty common. I don't know that many folks knew much about safety.

Then again, her and my granddad were married 51 years before she died of early-onset Alzheimer's.

They actually escaped poverty - my granddad worked in the rail yard for Missouri Pacific Railroad in his teens, worked his way to a degree in college, and retired at age 61 as their National Sales Manager. Incredible journey. Truly lived the American Dream.

[Nutria]

She grew up in Appalachia - I think it was pretty common. I don't know that many folks knew much about safety.

As mentioned in my PM to you, of my very large genealogy tree, only the Appalachians bred that young. Everyone else, even 300 years ago, knew better.

[GoodSteward]

Kids today are being raised to be entitled to everything. While the change in child labor has been a big help to the safety of our children, we have run to the opposite extreme now and they get everything for nothing. Just look at Walmart on Black friday. People are fighting just to buy their kids something else to make sure they are not "deprived."

Each family must make their own choices, but as I have stated before any relationship that is not properly maintained will dissolve. If you choose to follow your career, as most do and many have to(single parent homes and lower income homes where two incomes are required), please leave the career at work when you get home. You can't buy your way out of not spending time with your kids. People who stay at home are not "better" than those who don't. It really comes down to how you are once you are with the children, which should be a daily thing.

Personally, I don't like the idea of my kids being raised by someone else, and us just being the night nanny. They spend a few hours with us, we feed them and put them to bed. We did that for years, and I do not want to do it again with my next two we have(one here and one on the way). If it wasn't for me having two incomes, I'm not sure we could afford to have her stay at home. I am very thankful for the opportunity for that right now.

[Nika]

That said, the phenomenon of handing a 6-week child over to a day care or institution to raise is a recent one. I think it's a little nutty myself, but to each his own.

This is because as a society, US is not interested in supporting the family (unlike all developed and developing nations - all but 2 have mandated paid maternity leave - another universal value). The policies here are not designed to help women stay in workplace, and women who have to leave their infants at 6 weeks old to keep their jobs are the most vulnerable ones, with least options and least resources.

To many people, children are a "gift from god" until the moment they are born, and than they instantly become woman's own selfish choice, that should not inconvenience anyone in any way, and not cost anybody a penny, especially not effect anyones business interest.
I am pregnant now, with a long-planned very much loved and wanted baby. And it is hard and exhausting, taxing on the body, and birth is traumatic. I cannot even imagine what it feels like to be going through all of this if this was not my choice! This would be a huge and traumatic violation of the body.

And what is “nutty” to me - is that same people who engineer restrictions aimed at making it impossible for poor women to have access to abortion (like travel far, have to stay there overnight for waiting period, etc), are the same people who do not want taxpayers money spent on supporting those women and children once they are born, when it should be obvious that if these women can't afford a night in a hotel, they cannot afford to raise that baby without assistance. And in the end, this argument will boil down to "well, she shouldn't have sex than” is not helpful for anyone.

Then again, I think a lot of things are nutty - like people protesting outside on Pennsylvania Avenue to stop global warming to save the polar bears, yet the next day, many of the same ilk are fighting tooth and nail to have the right to abort a pregnancy.

Global warming is not about polar bears! I can’t even begin to address a statement that implies that much ignorance, I simply don’t have that kind of time.

[Nutria]

And what is “nutty” to me - is that same people who engineer restrictions aimed at making it impossible for poor women to have access to abortion (like travel far, have to stay there overnight for waiting period, etc), are the same people who do not want taxpayers money spent on supporting those women and children once they are born, when it should be obvious that if these women can't afford a night in a hotel, they cannot afford to raise that baby without assistance.

Preventing pregnancy is a Solved Problem. I can't help it if females refuse to avail themselves of said Solutions.

And in the end, this argument will boil down to "well, she shouldn't have sex than” is not helpful for anyone.

Because the horse is already galloping far away from the barn?

[Nika]

Preventing pregnancy is a Solved Problem. I can't help it if females refuse to avail themselves of said Solutions.

Agree. Many people are simply being irresponsible. But not all and not always. While I never personally had an unplanned pregnancy, I know that it can statistically happen even if you do everything right and don't think it is up to me to judge every single situation.

Because the horse is already galloping far away from the barn?

And because you cannot "punish" the poor mother without punishing said "blessing from god".

I can't believe where this thread has gone. Look at my original post. Really, we went from that to old while man's nostalgia for the good old days, attacking working mothers, brining up abortion...

[Nutria]

And because you cannot "punish" the poor mother without punishing said "blessing from god".

Sure you can: seize the child from the poor white trash mother who probably votes Republican, and adopt it out to a deserving married transsexual couple.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

In trying to find the life/work balance, I thought about how different people have different approaches. Many see accumulation of money as a first step in achieving other goals, but sometimes those goals can be achieved with less money than we think if we prioritize them directly.

Indeed. I even think there is adventure in putting together a rich life in which richness is not defined by money. Who doesn't love a good adventure?

[GoodSteward]

Sure you can: seize the child from the poor white trash mother who probably votes Republican, and adopt it out to a deserving married transsexual couple.

3...2....1...

[bigdaddybus]

Nika, it took my wife and I quite a few years to figure out what the right work/life balance was for us. We have tried a lot of different arrangements over the years, some good and some bad, but I think the key to it all is good communication between my spouse and I to see if we are getting what we want out of the situation. (both short term and long term).

For instance my wife saved all her vacation when we had our first child and planned to take all her vacation and 12 weeks unpaid leave and then quit her job at a Fortune 30 company. She got licensed to do home daycare and started watching our child and two others. I came home when our daughter was about 6 months old with my wife sitting in the corner crying... " I like our kid, I just don't like other peoples kids"...." I miss adult conversations and the challenge of work".... So back to work she went. 15 years later we have no regrets.

A few months ago we sold our home in the most popular neighborhood, with the highest rated schools, and moved 30 miles away from town (where my wife and I work) to send our kids to smaller school, build a home next door to brother and sister in law so our combined 8 kids can go to school together and we can spend more time with family as that is a priority to us. We absolutely LOVE IT! I know more people in 1 month in a small town vs. 15 years in suburbia.

Enough rambling by me. I wish you the best, and I suggest just be willing to always reevaluate and change, be it an investment, where you live, or how you are raising your children.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Bigdaddy that's a fantastic story. I like the fact you sold and move somewhere else just to get a different feel for life.

I feel exactly the same way. Life is what you make of it. You make conscious decisions and only you and your partner can decide if it's worth it. Is it worth it to downshift now to work longer later? Is it worth it to put the pedal to the metal now and retire earlier? Only you can answer. There isn't a right answer there is only the answer for you and your family.

You choose Nika to live in NYC. You make more than most people in the country but it's a struggle. To you it's worth it. On the flip there are people who live a very rural life and make very little and struggle. The answer they hear is move to where jobs/pay is. No one answer is right, the only lifestyle is the one you want.

I think it's only as good as you make it and what you choose no matter how or where you live.

[Snydley]

As a career mom who has stayed home full time, worked part time, and worked full time since my now 9yo was born, in my experience it really is all about balance and doing your best to meet everyone's needs in the family.

I actually didn't like being home full time with a baby, and I found that my child did not need me to be home that much. I didn't like the center-based day care I toured, so when I went back to work I found a nanny share for my DD. She loved it.

My mother was a full time SAHM, and honestly, I wished she worked at least part-time. I hated being all that she lived for (with my brother), I didn't want her to volunteer for so many field trips, to be my girl scout leader, to be hovering SO much. Lots of SAHM's I know now remind me of how my mom was (and still is, to an extent)- too enmeshed in their kids' lives. The Feminine Mystique should be required reading for any woman considering being a full-time stay at home mom IMO.

I think it's Denmark with the happiest people on the planet and if I'm remembering correctly, 80% of the women work, but they key difference is, the average work week for both men and women is ~30hours. Everyone has time to truly be there for their kids and their partners as well as pursue their own interests.