Gas

[nixuzer]

Re: Gas

That’s just another lame excuse by the oil companies. Been there, done that.

Back during the Summer of 2000, there was a huge spike in gasoline prices. The oil companies said it was due to “shortages of reformulated gasoline", "refineries closed down for maintenance", “increased demand”, and other bogus excuses.

A year-long investigation by the Federal Trade Commission concluded that the 2000 Summer's spike in gasoline prices was caused by refiners, who INTENTIONALLY WITHHELD GASOLINE FROM THE MARKET TO MAXIMIZE PROFITS. This report was presented to the current administration, which did nothing.

Now we have internal memos showing they’ve been doing the very same thing again since Katrina.

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Do you have a link to the FTC report? The only thing I could find was this, is there another report that you're referring to?

IV. Conclusion

The Commission has completed its investigation into the causes of the Midwest gasoline price spike in spring and early summer 2000. During the course of its investigation, the Commission examined a host of factors that have been suggested as possible causes of the price spike. First and foremost, the Commission considered whether conduct that violated the antitrust laws - specifically, collusion - led to the price increases. Notably, the Commission's investigation uncovered no evidence tending to demonstrate the existence of collusive behavior, and considerable evidence suggesting that collusion was unlikely. The spike appears to have been caused by a combination of structural and operating decisions, unexpected supply and production difficulties, forecasting errors by some industry participants, and decisions by some firms to limit supply as they pursued profit-maximizing strategies. The gasoline price spike in the Midwest was short-lived. Soon after prices spiked, additional gasoline was produced and imported to the region, and prices dropped as quickly and dramatically as they had risen. Notwithstanding the industry's ability to respond to the short-term problem, the long-term refining imbalance in the United States must be addressed, or similar price spikes in the Midwest and other regions of the country are likely.

[PRICEPLUS]

Re: Gas

Well at least we don't have odd/even days like in the 70's. Hell, then you could not even get gas some days. I remeber people getiing gas stolen right out of their tanks. Not that bad yet!

[nixuzer]

Re: Gas

Talk about obscene 'profits'

http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/1139.html

[PRICEPLUS]

Re: Gas

Screwed by Big Government and Big Oil. Everyone points fingers but in the end there is no difference regardless of who is in power, The little guys like us always get stiffed!

[VJW]

Re: Gas

Do you have a link to the FTC report? The only thing I could find was this, is there another report that you're referring to?

No, that’s it. At least that’s the final version.

Keep in mind that the parameters that the FTC could act under were restricted by this administration and the Republican Congressional Majority, compared with the previous administration. The current standard requires evidence of collusion between multiple parties in violation of antitrust laws or evidence of monopoly behavior.

Even though the FTC found, for instance, that “The spike appears to have been caused by ... decisions by firms to maximize their profits (curtailing production, keeping available supply off the market)”, and any normal person would consider such activity fraudulent, and it was illegal under the previous parameters that the FTC could act under, it was not actionable under the current parameters.

Just last week the Congressional Democrats proposed revamping the FTC standards back to the previous parameters and adding ‘Price Gouging’ language that is already existing in several states, but the Congressional Republicans are pushing a gas gouging bill that exempts price-gouging entirely on the wholesale level and only applies to retail gouging. Big surprise.

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[VJW]

Re: Gas

Talk about obscene 'profits'

Merely regurgitated propaganda from the oil industry that claims they are only making 8.5 cents on the dollar, but who are actually making about $50 per barrel of oil as producers at the current market price.

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[catlinye_maker]

Re: Gas

Prices are up because the oil companies are price-gouging so they can make record profits:

INTERNAL MEMOS SHOW OIL COMPANIES INTENTIONALLY LIMITED REFINING CAPACITY TO DRIVE UP GASOLINE PRICES

n.b.: In a capitalist society, this is known as "good business practice".

[VJW]

Re: Gas

Market manipulation is illegal, not a “good business practice”.

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[shelbylovesmelby]

Re: Gas

Sorry if this is a repeat but have you seen this?

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1841989&page=1&gma=true&gma=true

I'd like a 1/5 of what he's getting!

Nice to see where some of our gas money goes too?!?!

[nixuzer]

Re: Gas

Sorry if this is a repeat but have you seen this?

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1841989&page=1&gma=true&gma=true

I'd like a 1/5 of what he's getting!

Nice to see where some of our gas money goes too?!?!

You are aware that surviving on that kind of money is a struggle, I mean a million here and a million there goes REALLY quick. He probabaly even spends some time on this site trying to figure out ways to stretch his retirement $$.

[Bruce Wayne]

Re: Gas

I see the democrats have been spouting their usual anti business rhetoric over there in America. It seems that many Americans regard cheap fuel as a right. As a resident of a country that charges twice as much for petrol as you guys, trust me, you can afford it much higher than it currently is and you'll probably have to over the coming years.

All this twaddle about oil companies manipulating the markets is political spin to try and earn brownie points. Oil prices are generally determined on the international markets. So increased demand from China, India et al coupled with political unrest in Iran, Iraq, Nigeria et al are driving prices up.

It's about time Americans looked at themselves, stopped driving their big gas guzzlers and perhaps lived close to things rather than in the middle of nowhere!

[VJW]

Re: Gas

Bruce,

I see the democrats have been spouting their usual anti business rhetoric over there in America.

If the Democrats are “anti business”, why did American business, not to mention the stock markets, perform so much better during the previous eight years compared to the recent five years ?

All this twaddle about oil companies manipulating the markets is political spin to try and earn brownie points.

No, actually, it is a documented fact.

Oil prices are generally determined on the international markets. So increased demand from China, India et al coupled with political unrest in Iran, Iraq, Nigeria et al are driving prices up.

Nope. THAT is the spin.

OPEC, for the third time in as many months, reiterated that there is no shortage of supply. Oil inventories in America are up to the highest level since May 1999.

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[cicy33]

Re: Gas

It is very easy to say live closer to where you work but that is not always a possibility. I used to live really close to my job but it ended and I had to find work. so now I have to drive 30 miles. I do wonder what the pay ratio is for the one that says 6.50 a gallon is what we should be paying? Our average worker here makes minimum wage. (illinois 6.50) Our tax is 7.5% currently. I think that if it goes up to much people won't be working. In the area that I live there is no public transportation available. NONE. Unless you count the one cab in the next town that you have to wait for an hour to arrive! If I lived in an area that offered it perhaps I would use it. But then again, the closest area to me that does is St Louis and I think the fear of being molested, or killed would be enough to keep driving.

[Bruce Wayne]

Re: Gas

In Britain the minimum wage is £5.35 / $9.78 per hour, which works out at £11,128 / $20,350.92 per year gross. Of that the government will take around 16% of that leaving you with £9,376.30 / $17,147.41 net per year. As you earn more the tax rates increase up to a maximum of 40% for all income over £32,400 / $59,253.14.

Petrol here costs $6.40 per gallon with somewhere around 75% of that price taxation.

[VJW]

Re: Gas

In America, the Federal Minimum Wage is almost half of that, at $5.15/hour. Britain has a larger Middle-class (as a percentage of the population) than does America. The Poverty rate in America is double what it is in Britain, and the inequality of income is much worse.

I reiterate that a large part of the taxation of your vehicle fuels is to incentivize your mass transit. Unfortunately, we have no mass transit to incentivize.

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