Frustrated

[BCHGRL]

I consider myself frugal in training. My car is paid off and my fiance's will be soon. We rarely eat out. We take our lunch to work every day, and I take it in a plastic bag that I get from the grocery store.

We bought a house a year ago. After a hurricane hit our area in 2004, the housing prices doubled overnight so we paid $92K more than the last homeowners who bought the house new in 2003 and made no upgrades. We could not buy a home before that point because it took me a good year to clear up the damage caused to my credit by identity theft. I have to commute 45 mins to work because my FI and I could not afford housing closer to my job.

We are now trying to pay for our wedding which is in April. I tried to pay for it without credit cards unsuccessfully. I estimate we'll owe just under $10K when it is all said and done. I just don't understand why it costs so much just to have one nice day to celebrate. For instance: photographer $1500 (lowest price one we could find), cake $620, wedding dress $257+$753 (I had my mom's dress remade for $200, then the cleaners ruined it so I had to buy a new one plus alterations), Flowers $600 (silk), food $2,500. We didn't hire any fancy transportation and we're not going to have a videographer. We're going on a honeymoon a year from now. I am having a beach wedding too and everyone will be casual.

My fiance and I, ages 27 and 25, make over $100K a year, but you wouldn't know it to look at us. We don't buy clothes often, and we don't dress fashionably. Both of our cars are older models, and we're not shopping for new ones. We both contribute substantially to our 401Ks.

I try to read frugal advice, and everything seems to read "spend less than what you earn." It sounds really easy in theory. No offense, but I'm having trouble finding worthy advice on how to implement it. The average wedding costs $22,000 (a mid-sized car) and average housing in our area is about $260K, and the price of everything else is rising (i.e. gas, healthcare, etc.). Even saving $10K from an "average" wedding, I'm still paying the same amount as a small used car.

There is so much discussion about how much debt is owed by my generation, as if nothing has changed from previous generations. However, when you have no choice but to pay 3xs more for a home than your parents did, of course you are going to be in debt! When you can choose to have no wedding or have one for the cost of a small car, you're probably going to want a wedding anyways. At least I do. And I can't even imagine paying for a child. When my coworkers tell me what they pay for daycare, I can't imagine how my fiance or I could ever afford children.

I just feel like giving up and just living for today. Somehow prices can escalate beyond belief and no one cares, but the consumer is to blame for all the debt situation. My fiance and I love our parents dearly, but in our parents were the ones who lived for the day. Our parents had no savings for our education, our vehicles, and now our wedding. I don't mean to sound unappreciative, but I am tired of hearing how much better other generations were about saving. Maybe everything just costs too much now.

[abowers]

Re: Frustrated

I can agree with you. My boyfriend and I are in Princeton NJ right now while he works on his PhD. There is no way on earth we can afford a house in this area. We cannot find a townhouse in this area for less than $230k unless we want to be in Trenton (not so safe). Houses in Princeton are no less than $350k and go way way way up. Everyone here complains about housing prices, apparently they've been steadily going up for the past 5 or 6 years. We moved here from the suburbs of Rochester NY where my boyfriend's parents sold their 2000 sq foot house with .75 acre for $150k. There is no way we'll be able to afford a house here, and unless the housing bubble pops we will probably be looking for a more affordable area to live in a couple years when he's done with his PhD.

I am working as a preschool teacher right now, and I was shocked to find out how much it costs to have your child in daycare as well. I can't remember all the numbers, but the kids in my preschool class that come only part time (2 days a week) their parents pay $8,000/year. Full time might be around $12-13k/year. The prices are higher than that if the child is a "toddler" and even higher than that if the child is an infant. If you have 2 children, you only get 10% off the second child. This is an excellent program though, and it is located right on the campus of one of the big pharmaceutical companies, intended for children of the parents that work at this corporate office. A couple of my coworkers are pregnant/just had a baby, and they are debating between continuing to work full time and basically paying their whole paycheck to the center we work at so their child can be there, or staying home and being able to actually see their child.

My boyfriends parents were very good about saving -- when they sold their house last summer they had paid off their mortgage already, but now they have another one because their new town also has more expensive houses. They put 3 boys through 3 private colleges. My parents on the other hand, did not save for college for me at all. They did help me out by taking out some loans, but I have $18k in loans myself, from undergrad. My parents still have a while left on their mortgage.

My friends from home and friends at work keep asking when my boyfriend and I are getting married -- I tell them I'm in no hurry to actually get married because I don't have $10k lying around to pay for a wedding!! We are comfortable on my income and my boyfriend's graduate stipend, which is bigger than my paycheck -- it totals to around $50k/year I think. But we don't have tons of extra money to throw around (he has a little more than me, I'm making a car payment and working on paying off student loans). He's going to be making the same amount of money for the next couple years until he's done with his PhD, and I'm wanting to go back to school as well to get my master's. I'm trying to figure out how to juggle work with schoool. I will make more money after I get my master's and get the job I want, but until then, I anticipate money being a little tight.

That's enough of my ranting.

[PrincessPerky]

Re: Frustrated

It is hard and costs are rising, but.... you don't have to have such a 'fancy' wedding. Not that you can't it is your wedding, your choice. I had a pretty cool wedding myself .

All I am saying is most of that IS luxury, My hot shower is a luxury! I woulldn't go into debt for it, but I will take longer paying off the house for it!

I guess what I am trying to say is anything beyond shelter, food, and medical IS a luxury, choose and enjoy the ones you want to keep.

[Lostsoul33]

Re: Frustrated

Well you could always do what I did and get married in the backyard of the justice of the peace. Afterwards you have a nice luncheon and you're done. We saved a lot of money that way as we had decided that having money for a house was more important than the big wedding. I know that not everyone wants that though. Totally understand that. Is it possible to get a loan to pay for wedding expenses? Atleast then the interest rates wouldn't be so outrageous.
Just don't give up on saving money and being frugal. It can be done and you will get ahead. You both have good incomes so that's one thing on your side. Maybe the others will come in with some good advice. I'm sure they will.

[Ima saver]

Re: Frustrated

I had a wonderful wedding ( I thought) and we only spent about $100. We got married at home and we wore clothes we already have. Some friends brought over covered dishes and one made a cake for me. They all took pictures with their cameras. We had an open bar (that is where most of the money went) and had a party after the ceremont. We have been married almost 20 years.
I went to a fancy wedding a few years ago with a live band , sit down supper, open bar, etc. It cost about $50,000. The couple are now divorced.
I goofed, we have been married almost 30 years.
Houses cost a lot less back then, but we only made $1 an hour when we bought it.

[Keen]

Re: Frustrated

"average wedding costs $22,000 (a mid-sized car) and average housing in our area is about $260K," and the average family in the US is broke. Your income is WELL above average if you keep your lifestyle "below" average it will pay off in the long run!


I can feel your pain however, we spent just over 10k on our wedding and I thought it was great but the prices these suppliers charge (Photo, Tux's, etc>) was a joke.

Just cut where you can and negotiate everything! Then if you are still going to spend to much just enjoy the day...you had better because you will be paying for it for a while!

[mjrube94]

Re: Frustrated

No offense, but I'm having trouble finding worthy advice on how to implement it.

BCHGRL, That's the whole point of this site. If you go through the forums, and especially through the blogs, you'll find lots of concrete things that people have done to save money. Jeffrey also has a series of daily financial challenges that are intended to take only a few minutes per day, but help your overall bottom line. They're really worthwhile.

Do you have a written budget? If not, it would be a great first step to make one and see EXACTLY where your money is going (and not just where you THINK it's going). Then start with your biggest monthly expense and, using advice from this site, really think about ways you can reduce it. Then move on to the next line item. I'd be surprised if you can't find a way to free up some extra money.

If you're still having trouble, let us know. Either start a thread (or even better, start a blog). Mention what you're doing and where you're struggling and we'll give you some ideas. I think you'll find a lot of really supportive people on this site...

[Ima saver]

Re: Frustrated

I was thinking about what you said about the average home costing $260,000. When I bought my first home (after saving for a year and a half for the down payment) it cost $13,000. My husband and I together were making less than $5000 a year. So we bought a house that was about 2 1/2 years salary for us.
You two make over $100,000 so a house like you mention , is about 2 1/2 years salary for you both. Things really have not changed that much, some things, like tv's have even gotten cheaper. MJrube had some real good points.

[byusteeler]

Re: Frustrated

I say barter and talk to friends. My Daughter got married in the fall of 2003. We only spent about $1500 on the whole deal. That is her dad and my portion. I don't know what her husband's mom spent on the wedding luncheon. My brother did the photography and videography at cost of pictures and developing as a wedding gift. We used the church which was free. My daughters friend has a wedding decoration business so she did the decorations as a gift. My neighbor made her dress as a gift (she does this professionally and is quite good at it) we felt it was too much work for nothing so we paid her $125 the most she would let us. We borrowed the petty coat and veil from the same neighbor. We made sheet cakes for the reception and bought a 10 inch and a 6 inch cake from our favorite baker. Sheet cakes we made at home cost us about $20 to make we had 3 half sheet size. Cakes from the bakery cost us $47. We had them only iced at the baker and then our flower lady decorated them for us. If you say it is a wedding cake they double the price so we didn't say. (this goes for most things add the work wedding and the price doubles.) Flowers were $60 my daughter chose purple daisies which are quite inexpensive. The cake topper was about $40. We bought it at hallmark. We made center pieces from IBC root beer bottles and daisies with ivory and lavender ribbons. Friends at my daughters work hired a DJ for her and her husbands Tongan friends did polynesian dancing. It was a beautiful wedding. The announcements were about $400.00 that was the most expensive thing we purchased. We did it on the cheap out of necessity as I was in the middle of a 3 year furlough from my job which had cut our household income in half. We know we are lucky to have such great friends and family that were able to help us. But it can be done and as I say with most things it is about priorities and ours was to not go into debt or have our daughter start her marriage in debt either. I would have liked to done more but it just was not possible at the time.

As for the house My mom paid $7000 for her home in the 50's. Less than 1 1/2 time the average salary at the time. Our first house in the 80's was about 3 times our annual salary at the time and a house in many places (luckily not ours) is about 10 times the average annual salary. I paid $107,000 for my second home in '95 and my daughter paid $105,000 for her 1st home in "04. My daughter kind of lucked out. Our 1st home was $60,000 so she paid way less than 2 times that and her home is nicer than our 1st home. Although about the same size.

I think the government (all houses) is so out of touch with main stream america that they can't see how inflation has effected the daily and monthly expenditures. Just because inflation hasn't effected the every 10 year expenditures they think it is under control. I keep hearing how great the economy is yet nobody I know sees it. I guess because we are not in the upper class.

Anyway, congatualations. Make it a joyous occassion. Quit stressing about the cost of everything. Set a budget stick to it and remember the good things.

[contrary1]

Re: Frustrated

I think the questions are all about want & need..........like all things financial! Then, weighing the wants, until you can find out what is really important to you. If a wedding & a house are tied & you really want both, then they both have to cost less.
I would vote for the house, skipping the wedding entirely ...........but that's just me. Can't re sell a wedding.........it isn't even an investment in your future. It's just a "want".
Perhaps a wedding thread needs to be started and all things frugal pertaining to weddings can be grouped together?? I know there are more ways to save money on weddings than there are to spend!!

[Ima saver]

Re: Frustrated

I would much rather has a cheap fun wedding and use the rest of the money as a down payment on a house. I bought my first house in 1967, brand new, 3 bedroom 2 bath for $13,000. We added on about $7000 worth of impovements (room and pool) and sold it in 1974 for $40,000. A house usually appreciates and is worth the money.

[Fern]

Re: Frustrated

Well, if you wanted to save money on the wedding, do you really need a $600 cake and a $600 for flowers? If that's really what it takes to make you happy, ok, but you don't have to do it just because that's what other people do.

Think about what is important to you and like others here have said, you can be creative and come up with much cheaper alternatives. Remember, this day is for YOU, not to impress anyone else.

For me, the most important things would be the photographer and the food, so that guests can enjoy themselves. But I would skip the flowers, expensive cake, fancy invitations, etc. I don't think they're worth it.

[katwoman]

Re: Frustrated

Hi there and welcome to the forum!

As you can tell we have some verrrry frugal people on the board. THere's nothing wrong with wanting a nice wedding and if you can do yours for 10K and get all the bells and whistles......well, that's great!

You may have been shortchanged by your parents, but it sounds like you've got your act together in spite of being overwhelmed with the burden of it all (for the moment).

Do what you need to do (get married and enjoy YOUR wedding) and stick around! Read the blogs and little by little you will see ways of saving and cutting expenses and investing that will serve you well in the years to come. You're already in a envious position! You have an education, make great money, contribute to your retirement and own a home. If you can do all that, the rest will be gravvvy.

One thing I have noticed while belonging to these types of boards....it seems difficult for 2 income families to understand that saving money is easy! And it is EASY. But it does take discipline and effort. In fact, it's almost like a job, if you REALLY want to see BIG gains. In your case it sounds like you'd even welcome any gains. Just spend the time here and I'm sure you will make great strides.

Good luck and congratulations!

[Ima saver]

Re: Frustrated

You are right, Kat, it is almost like a job. I stopped working in 1990 and just took care of the books. When I mention going back to work for minimum wage, my husband said he would rather work a couple of hours extra each day to have me at home.
I know things cost a lot more these days, but do we really need all this stuff that we have?Developing an attitude like that has helped me. We will go shopping (like when we visit Gatlinburg) and my husband will say, you did not buy a thing!! Well, what do I need??

[katwoman]

Re: Frustrated

You are right, Kat, it is almost like a job. I stopped working in 1990 and just took care of the books. When I mention going back to work for minimum wage, my husband said he would rather work a couple of hours extra each day to have me at home.
I know things cost a lot more these days, but do we really need all this stuff that we have?Developing an attitude like that has helped me. We will go shopping (like when we visit Gatlinburg) and my husband will say, you did not buy a thing!! Well, what do I need??

I'm with you, but like you said, you developed the attitude. I used to spend, spend, spend, too! Nothing like a move to get someone to face reality. Why did I buy all this sh!t?

Changing attitude is hard. I had to change mine when my mom got sick and I took over her finances. If I was going to quit work, her income needed to cover the both of us without having to dip into the investments. Heck, if I can do this, everyone can do this. Trust me, my mom may look good on paper but what comes in every month only goes for the basics. If I didn't cut to the bone, we would have to start liquidating.