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I think I got it now: Tax Rebate is an advance only

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  • I think I got it now: Tax Rebate is an advance only

    Not sure if you, guys, are all clear about the Tax Rebate, but me personally understood only today what it means for my 2008 taxes. So, I wanted to share some links in case you wanted to know too.

    This is an official document (it seems) to explain tax credits including the 2007 Tax Rebate http://www.house.gov/jct/x-16-08.pdf. The info about tax rebate starts on p.4.

    "Rebate checks

    Most taxpayers will receive this credit in the form of a check issued by the Department of the Treasury. The amount of the payment will be computed in the same manner as the credit, except that it will be done on the basis of tax returns filed for 2007 (instead of 2008. It is anticipated that the Department of the Treasury will make every effort to issue all payments as rapidly as possible to taxpayers who timely file their 2007 tax returns. (Taxpayers who file late or pursuant to extensions will receive their payments later.)

    Taxpayers will reconcile the amount of the credit with the payment they receive in the following manner. They will complete a worksheet calculating the amount of the credit based on their 2008 income tax return. They will then subtract from the credit the amount of the payment they received in 2008. For many taxpayers, these two amounts will be the same. If, however, the result is a positive number (because, for example, the taxpayer paid no tax in 2007 but is paying tax in 2008, the taxpayer may claim that amount as a refundable credit against 2008 tax liability. If, however, the result is negative (because, for example, the taxpayer paid tax in 2007 but owes no tax for 2008, the taxpayer is not required to repay that amount to the Treasury. Otherwise, the checks have no effect on tax returns filed for 2008; the amount is not includible in gross income and it does not otherwise reduce the amount of withholding ."

    Those Rebate Checks Are Really Just Advances On Future Refunds | KXNet.com North Dakota News

    So, this is what I understood. If I assume our income doesn't change in 2008, and no changes in the family, but after I do 1040 I see that I still owe $100, I'll have to return the IRS $1,400 next year ($1,500 is our Tax Rebate they're going to send us, IMO). Since we're going to have another child this year, that $1,400 would be reduced by a child credit (if we qualify).

    Do you think I understood it correctly? That English in the official document was not plain English to me and English is not my first language, btw.

  • #2
    Let me use an analogy. Let's say your company regularly gives you a $1,000 bonus at the end of the year. But this year your boss says, I'm going to increase your bonus from $1,000 to $1,500 this year. And just to be nice, I'll give you that $500 now.

    If you want to call that $500 an advance, that's fine, but you're ahead $500 for the year, no matter how you slice it. And on top of it you got that $500 right away so you could save or invest it and turn it into more by the end of the year if you want.

    It would take a lot of nerve for someone to say "But my end of year bonus is still $1,000. I'm getting ripped off."

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    • #3
      You will not have to pay anything back, and it will not reduce your regular refund or increase your regular taxes owed. In fact I think when you have the kid and do your 2008 taxes, you will qualify for an additional $300. The only reason we will have to do any rebate-related computation on our '08 taxes is to determine whether we actually qualify for an even bigger refund, in which case they'll send you the difference. If it turns out you got more than you should have, you still get to keep the money and it does not affect your regular taxation.

      Does that make more sense? Basically it's like they were going to tax us less on our '08 income by changing the tax tables in the 1040 workbook, but instead they decided, let's keep the '08 forms and tables the same, but give people the money now that they would have gotten if we'd reduced taxation in the '08 tax tables.

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      • #4
        I'm thinking of it as a one year abatement, rather than a rebate.
        "There is some ontological doubt as to whether it may even be possible in principle to nail down these things in the universe we're given to study." --text msg from my kid

        "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men." --Frederick Douglass

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        • #5
          Originally posted by ceejay74 View Post
          You will not have to pay anything back, and it will not reduce your regular refund or increase your regular taxes owed. In fact I think when you have the kid and do your 2008 taxes, you will qualify for an additional $300. The only reason we will have to do any rebate-related computation on our '08 taxes is to determine whether we actually qualify for an even bigger refund, in which case they'll send you the difference. If it turns out you got more than you should have, you still get to keep the money and it does not affect your regular taxation.

          Does that make more sense? Basically it's like they were going to tax us less on our '08 income by changing the tax tables in the 1040 workbook, but instead they decided, let's keep the '08 forms and tables the same, but give people the money now that they would have gotten if we'd reduced taxation in the '08 tax tables.
          Thanks CJ. I think I'm lost in all that English semantics. I understand "Rebate" in terms when I buy a PC, submit forms to the PC manufacturer, and I get some $ back. In the case of Tax Rebate, I cannot understand the word's meaning maybe because it's based on the future tax liability when I even don't know what it's going to be .
          When I read somewhere that this Rebate is an advance, I see it like people who file taxes but get an advance from HR Block while waiting for the refund. It's like a loan that has to be returned + interest, but in the Tax Rebate's case I see it as an interest FREE loan that will have to be returned.

          Anyway, yesterday I printed the passage out and when I read it at home again, it seemed to me that I was wrong, but STILL I am lost.

          So, in summary, do I just ignore the $1,500 rebate when I do our 2008 tax planning in my Excel?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by sweeps View Post
            Let me use an analogy. Let's say your company regularly gives you a $1,000 bonus at the end of the year. But this year your boss says, I'm going to increase your bonus from $1,000 to $1,500 this year. And just to be nice, I'll give you that $500 now.

            If you want to call that $500 an advance, that's fine, but you're ahead $500 for the year, no matter how you slice it. And on top of it you got that $500 right away so you could save or invest it and turn it into more by the end of the year if you want.

            It would take a lot of nerve for someone to say "But my end of year bonus is still $1,000. I'm getting ripped off."
            Sorry but you lost me in the last sentence. If the boss gave me $500 extra, then next year the bonus could be $500 lower.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by aida2003 View Post
              If the boss gave me $500 extra, then next year the bonus could be $500 lower.
              So you're assuming that if your boss gives you $1500 this year, he will only give you $500 next year? Sure it could happen, but that's a pretty pessimistic (and cynical) view.

              I don't see anywhere where it says the $600 (or $1200 or whatever) you're getting this year will make your taxes $600 (or $1200 or whatever) higher next year. If I missed that, please let me know.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by sweeps View Post
                So you're assuming that if your boss gives you $1500 this year, he will only give you $500 next year? Sure it could happen, but that's a pretty pessimistic (and cynical) view.

                I don't see anywhere where it says the $600 (or $1200 or whatever) you're getting this year will make your taxes $600 (or $1200 or whatever) higher next year. If I missed that, please let me know.
                That's the problem that I'm seeing in gray (or is it black?) all this rebate thing. As if I'm getting $ that will have to be returned next year, though the more I read it I'm getting more and more optimistic that this rebate will not affect my 2008 in any way........Grrr my brain seems clogged

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                • #9
                  While I am still confused as to weather we will get less back next spring when we file taxes..everything I have read says we will NOT owe based on this check coming. Is that part right at least?

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                  • #10
                    I get more confused everytime this is discussed....

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                    • #11
                      Ugh. Ok, last time...

                      The $600 or $1200 or whatever amount you are getting this summer. It is FREE money*. Yes, free! I know that doesn't happen very often but it's true. Spend it, save it, donate it... do whatever you want with it. And no, you will not have to pay taxes on that money either.

                      (* Now, having said that -- free money from the government isn't really free. Our deficits continue to rise and it is not that hard to believe that eventually taxes will go up and/or spending on programs will go down. But that is a separate discussion.)
                      Last edited by sweeps; 02-22-2008, 11:01 AM. Reason: Mentioned that you do not have to pay taxes on the "rebate"

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by sweeps View Post
                        Ugh. Ok, last time...

                        The $600 or $1200 or whatever amount you are getting this summer. It is FREE money*.
                        Thank you for that. I think the problem is we are all just so skeptical of anything the government does that we can't believe they would give out money with no consequences down the line.

                        Still, I'm not going out and spending it. I haven't done my taxes yet but expect to owe as much or more than the "rebate" will be, so it will just be replenishing our savings.
                        Steve

                        * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
                        * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
                        * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

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                        • #13
                          Thanks for your patience, Sweeps, and repeating the same thing to us, Kindergarteners .

                          I also posted my questions one the tax forum and two guys also said that based on what we all know now, this money is a FREE gift. And in my case (PP, for you, too ), since we expect a child this year we'll get an extra $300 when we file 2008 taxes. That's what the tax guy wrote.

                          Anyway, I'll do my 2008 planning by ignoring the tax rebate, including the potential extra $300 (just in case the gov't changes its mind).

                          Case closed (for now)

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by disneysteve View Post
                            Thank you for that. I think the problem is we are all just so skeptical of anything the government does that we can't believe they would give out money with no consequences down the line.

                            Still, I'm not going out and spending it. I haven't done my taxes yet but expect to owe as much or more than the "rebate" will be, so it will just be replenishing our savings.
                            Yep, I was definitely skeptical. I agree

                            This year thanks to my stupid oversight of CD interest, we owe $902 to Fed and $654 to NC. There goes my rebate . My goal is to improve our tax planning so we don't pay more than $500-$700 combined next year.

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                            • #15
                              we are gonna save our $1200 right away in a cd that earns great interest i hope... lol.........no spending on this windfall.....

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